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	<title>Comments on: Another chapter in EEStory</title>
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	<link>http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/</link>
	<description>Trends, happenings and innovations in the clean technology market</description>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/comment-page-1/#comment-2158</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:08:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/#comment-2158</guid>
		<description>I have heard very little comment on the EEStor/ZENN impact on the infrastructure of not only the US, but CHina, India, etc.  It&#039;s great to say:&quot;Well it can charge in 4 hours on household current during non-peak hours&quot;.  Maybe the US can eventually ramp up to that but what about the rest of the world.  This is truily an energy t&lt;u&gt;&lt;em&gt;ransfer &lt;/em&gt;&lt;/u&gt;system.  A true ultracapacitor will charge and discharge in seconds using 1.5 to 3 volts.  And, it can be charged at home iusing a small solar/wind array with far less impact on the electrical grid.  Can you impagine a 400 lb battery both in your home and in your garage?

The technology may work but is it practical for the uses it was developed for?

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have heard very little comment on the EEStor/ZENN impact on the infrastructure of not only the US, but CHina, India, etc.  It&#8217;s great to say:&#8221;Well it can charge in 4 hours on household current during non-peak hours&#8221;.  Maybe the US can eventually ramp up to that but what about the rest of the world.  This is truily an energy t<u><em>ransfer </em></u>system.  A true ultracapacitor will charge and discharge in seconds using 1.5 to 3 volts.  And, it can be charged at home iusing a small solar/wind array with far less impact on the electrical grid.  Can you impagine a 400 lb battery both in your home and in your garage?</p>
<p>The technology may work but is it practical for the uses it was developed for?</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/comment-page-1/#comment-2157</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Aug 2008 18:10:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/#comment-2157</guid>
		<description>Tyler,

Your Technology Review article stated that Zenn expects to have an EEstor powered CityZenn commercially available in late 2009.

Can you tell me if Richard Weir&#039;s prediction for a commercial release &quot;as early as possible in 2009&quot; was limited to &quot;potential partners in the solar and wind industry&quot;, or was Weir also stating that Zenn would not receive the first production line EESUs until 2009 as well?

&lt;em&gt;The company is also in serious talks with potential partners in the solar and wind industry, where EEStor&#039;s technology can, according to Weir, help put 45 percent more energy into the grid. He says that the company is working toward commercial production &quot;as soon as possible in 2009,&quot; although when asked, he gave no specific date. &quot;I&#039;m not going to make claims on when we&#039;re going to get product out there. That&#039;s between me and the customer. I don&#039;t want to tell the industry.&quot;

&lt;/em&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tyler,</p>
<p>Your Technology Review article stated that Zenn expects to have an EEstor powered CityZenn commercially available in late 2009.</p>
<p>Can you tell me if Richard Weir&#8217;s prediction for a commercial release &#8220;as early as possible in 2009&#8243; was limited to &#8220;potential partners in the solar and wind industry&#8221;, or was Weir also stating that Zenn would not receive the first production line EESUs until 2009 as well?</p>
<p><em>The company is also in serious talks with potential partners in the solar and wind industry, where EEStor&#8217;s technology can, according to Weir, help put 45 percent more energy into the grid. He says that the company is working toward commercial production &#8220;as soon as possible in 2009,&#8221; although when asked, he gave no specific date. &#8220;I&#8217;m not going to make claims on when we&#8217;re going to get product out there. That&#8217;s between me and the customer. I don&#8217;t want to tell the industry.&#8221;</p>
<p></em></p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/comment-page-1/#comment-2156</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Aug 2008 01:13:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/#comment-2156</guid>
		<description>The military interest in EEStor doesn&#039;t have to involve death rays or weapons at all. Amory Lovins correctly points out that a largest portion of any military operation is logistics: in particular, moving petrol around, which it needs for everything from powering its bases to fueling the vehicles. It&#039;s a major budget-devourer and worse: in places like Iraq and Afghanistan, it&#039;s a real source of casualties. The capability to create their own energy from renewables like solar twinned with effective, lightweight storage systems would be extremely beneficial.

Napoleon said that an army marches on its stomach--the success of any campaign is determined as much by energy as by weaponry. In WWII Hitler&#039;s first move was to secure a reliable supply of Norwegian oil. I&#039;m sure that in the US, the politicians are the ones interested in deathrays, but the generals are probably more interested in mobile energy.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The military interest in EEStor doesn&#8217;t have to involve death rays or weapons at all. Amory Lovins correctly points out that a largest portion of any military operation is logistics: in particular, moving petrol around, which it needs for everything from powering its bases to fueling the vehicles. It&#8217;s a major budget-devourer and worse: in places like Iraq and Afghanistan, it&#8217;s a real source of casualties. The capability to create their own energy from renewables like solar twinned with effective, lightweight storage systems would be extremely beneficial.</p>
<p>Napoleon said that an army marches on its stomach&#8211;the success of any campaign is determined as much by energy as by weaponry. In WWII Hitler&#8217;s first move was to secure a reliable supply of Norwegian oil. I&#8217;m sure that in the US, the politicians are the ones interested in deathrays, but the generals are probably more interested in mobile energy.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/comment-page-1/#comment-2155</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Aug 2008 00:56:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/#comment-2155</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not sure all the mystery surrounding EEStor needs to be explained by military secrecy, conspiracy, etc.

Think about it: the technology EEStor promises is HUGE for any end use: military, domestic or transportation. It&#039;s like cold fusion.

I have no doubt that they&#039;re on to something good, but we all know that the road from &quot;good idea&quot; to implementation is long, complicated and risky.

Imagine a lottery ticket that has a 10% chance of winning 10 million dollars: those are great odds, considering the payout, and you&#039;d be crazy not to buy it. Indeed it&#039;s the chance of a lifetime. But you&#039;d also be crazy to bank on it: there&#039;s a 90% chance it won&#039;t be the winner.

I think that&#039;s the situation that EEStor finds itself in. They&#039;re either sitting on a goldmine, or nothing at all. And they won&#039;t know which until the process of development has played itself out. I&#039;m sure they&#039;re right to be excited by whatever it is they&#039;re on to--whatever it is that makes them think they&#039;ve got a good chance of developping this technology to commercialisation.

But they&#039;re also right to be cautious, to not count their eggs till after they&#039;ve hatched, because even with a great idea, and the best people working on it, and some serious investors/partners, the whole thing could still fizzle. There are no guarantees in this business. Ever heard of Ballard?

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not sure all the mystery surrounding EEStor needs to be explained by military secrecy, conspiracy, etc.</p>
<p>Think about it: the technology EEStor promises is HUGE for any end use: military, domestic or transportation. It&#8217;s like cold fusion.</p>
<p>I have no doubt that they&#8217;re on to something good, but we all know that the road from &#8220;good idea&#8221; to implementation is long, complicated and risky.</p>
<p>Imagine a lottery ticket that has a 10% chance of winning 10 million dollars: those are great odds, considering the payout, and you&#8217;d be crazy not to buy it. Indeed it&#8217;s the chance of a lifetime. But you&#8217;d also be crazy to bank on it: there&#8217;s a 90% chance it won&#8217;t be the winner.</p>
<p>I think that&#8217;s the situation that EEStor finds itself in. They&#8217;re either sitting on a goldmine, or nothing at all. And they won&#8217;t know which until the process of development has played itself out. I&#8217;m sure they&#8217;re right to be excited by whatever it is they&#8217;re on to&#8211;whatever it is that makes them think they&#8217;ve got a good chance of developping this technology to commercialisation.</p>
<p>But they&#8217;re also right to be cautious, to not count their eggs till after they&#8217;ve hatched, because even with a great idea, and the best people working on it, and some serious investors/partners, the whole thing could still fizzle. There are no guarantees in this business. Ever heard of Ballard?</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/comment-page-1/#comment-2154</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 16:33:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/#comment-2154</guid>
		<description>Please wake me up when an automotive size unit is ready for sale.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Please wake me up when an automotive size unit is ready for sale.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/comment-page-1/#comment-2152</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 01:51:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/#comment-2152</guid>
		<description>Indeed: I thought about Japan, but I didn&#039;t bother to include them because they aren&#039;t allowed to buy significant amounts of offensive weaponry.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Indeed: I thought about Japan, but I didn&#8217;t bother to include them because they aren&#8217;t allowed to buy significant amounts of offensive weaponry.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/comment-page-1/#comment-2153</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 01:12:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/#comment-2153</guid>
		<description>Tyler, since you are canadian and also intrigued by the EESTOR story perhaps you might be interested in doing a little digging on ENERGENEUS. I found a patent of theirs that appears to have close parallels to the EESTOR patents.

http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/en/wo.jsp?IA=IB1997000985&amp;DISPLAY=DESC

The idea is quite similar to EESTOR&#039;s superficially in that its about making a super capacitor out of Barium titanate at astronomical energy densities.

Like EESTOR&#039;s first patent, there is no mention of dielectric saturation and they appear to assume k will remain high at high field strength.

The applicant is ENERGENIUS from the Toronto area (try google). If you go their website you will see very encouraging activity until suddenly all went quite in 2003. I wonder what ever happened to their &quot;Proprietary Triple-S Energy Storage Technology&quot;. I also don&#039;t know how much funding they ever got but it would certainly be interesting to find out and compare...

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tyler, since you are canadian and also intrigued by the EESTOR story perhaps you might be interested in doing a little digging on ENERGENEUS. I found a patent of theirs that appears to have close parallels to the EESTOR patents.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/en/wo.jsp?IA=IB1997000985&#038;DISPLAY=DESC" onclick="javascript:pageTracker._trackPageview('/outbound/comment/www.wipo.int');" rel="nofollow">http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/en/wo.jsp?IA=IB1997000985&#038;DISPLAY=DESC</a></p>
<p>The idea is quite similar to EESTOR&#8217;s superficially in that its about making a super capacitor out of Barium titanate at astronomical energy densities.</p>
<p>Like EESTOR&#8217;s first patent, there is no mention of dielectric saturation and they appear to assume k will remain high at high field strength.</p>
<p>The applicant is ENERGENIUS from the Toronto area (try google). If you go their website you will see very encouraging activity until suddenly all went quite in 2003. I wonder what ever happened to their &#8220;Proprietary Triple-S Energy Storage Technology&#8221;. I also don&#8217;t know how much funding they ever got but it would certainly be interesting to find out and compare&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/comment-page-1/#comment-2151</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 17:59:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/#comment-2151</guid>
		<description>Yes, but the Japanese military philosophy for the last 60 years has been fundamentally different to ours. Written into their constitution after WWII is a ban on offensive military actions, and their military has been structured in a purely defensive manner. It does seem to be shifting a bit as of late, with their limited assistance in Afghanistan I believe, but it would still take a major paradigm shift in their military philosophy to heavily invest in these types of weapons for the purpose of increasing their global clout.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, but the Japanese military philosophy for the last 60 years has been fundamentally different to ours. Written into their constitution after WWII is a ban on offensive military actions, and their military has been structured in a purely defensive manner. It does seem to be shifting a bit as of late, with their limited assistance in Afghanistan I believe, but it would still take a major paradigm shift in their military philosophy to heavily invest in these types of weapons for the purpose of increasing their global clout.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/comment-page-1/#comment-2150</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 17:27:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/#comment-2150</guid>
		<description>What about Japan? They have a fairly sound economy and gigantic surpluses.

Anyway, the Asian countries will soon rise to lead the world and they have already shown that they do not like the US bringing &quot;democracy&quot; and &quot;peace&quot; to the world. The game is changing.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What about Japan? They have a fairly sound economy and gigantic surpluses.</p>
<p>Anyway, the Asian countries will soon rise to lead the world and they have already shown that they do not like the US bringing &#8220;democracy&#8221; and &#8220;peace&#8221; to the world. The game is changing.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/comment-page-1/#comment-2149</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 16:47:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cleanbreak.ca/2008/08/05/another-chapter-in-eestory/#comment-2149</guid>
		<description>To put it another way: the US is essentially bankrupt. Soon it won&#039;t be able to maintain its military expenditures, and will slowly start scaling back. Russia is essentially bankrupt, and it HAS been scaling back its military expenditures. Every country in Europe has been teetering on the edge of financial oblivion since the end of World War Two; they can barely afford what they have now.

That leaves: China, India, Brazil, Australia, and Canada. Canada and Australia don&#039;t have large military budgets. Brazil and India are still relatively poor countries, and they will be for the next couple decades. That leaves ONE country that can buy a fair number of these things, and that&#039;s China. And even China can&#039;t spend more than a trillion or two.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To put it another way: the US is essentially bankrupt. Soon it won&#8217;t be able to maintain its military expenditures, and will slowly start scaling back. Russia is essentially bankrupt, and it HAS been scaling back its military expenditures. Every country in Europe has been teetering on the edge of financial oblivion since the end of World War Two; they can barely afford what they have now.</p>
<p>That leaves: China, India, Brazil, Australia, and Canada. Canada and Australia don&#8217;t have large military budgets. Brazil and India are still relatively poor countries, and they will be for the next couple decades. That leaves ONE country that can buy a fair number of these things, and that&#8217;s China. And even China can&#8217;t spend more than a trillion or two.</p>
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